[BSpringsteen]

I think we are all in complete shock that this was Penn State and Joe Pa. To people outside of the program, they were almost beyond reproach. To people inside the school, to the fans Joe Pa was a God. Hayden Fry times ten.

How would we react if this happened Hayden's last year? Probably in the same state of disbelief.

Doesn't mean it didn't happen. Just because we love someone doesn't mean they are not capable of things we don't want to think about.

There is just too much out there right now that points to this being a really bad cover up. And Joe Paterno, as the head of the football program, and the face of the University had to be neck deep in it. No way that he wasn't. No way.

When even non fans love Paterno, it makes believing that he could have been involved in something like this even harder to believe. But when you think about all the facts that no one thought twice about (like the top assistant coach in the country retiring at 55) you can't escape the gnawing feeling in your gut that this is far from over, and it is going to shatter everything you thought you knew about Paterno.

Right now, he is guilty of poor judgement. That just doesn't add up to me. It either has to be him getting a raw deal or him being much more involved. I've never known a successful football coach at a football U being a scapegoat. I don't know why he would be made to be the fall guy for the University. Ergo - I don't think he is getting a raw deal.

There has to be more.

[Clark]

Originally Posted by BSpringsteen

I think we are all in complete shock that this was Penn State and Joe Pa. To people outside of the program, they were almost beyond reproach. To people inside the school, to the fans Joe Pa was a God. Hayden Fry times ten.

How would we react if this happened Hayden's last year? Probably in the same state of disbelief.

Doesn't mean it didn't happen. Just because we love someone doesn't mean they are not capable of things we don't want to think about.

There is just too much out there right now that points to this being a really bad cover up. And Joe Paterno, as the head of the football program, and the face of the University had to be neck deep in it. No way that he wasn't. No way.

When even non fans love Paterno, it makes believing that he could have been involved in something like this even harder to believe. But when you think about all the facts that no one thought twice about (like the top assistant coach in the country retiring at 55) you can't escape the gnawing feeling in your gut that this is far from over, and it is going to shatter everything you thought you knew about Paterno.

Right now, he is guilty of poor judgement. That just doesn't add up to me. It either has to be him getting a raw deal or him being much more involved. I've never known a successful football coach at a football U being a scapegoat. I don't know why he would be made to be the fall guy for the University. Ergo - I don't think he is getting a raw deal.

There has to be more.

Scapegoat is too leniant. The evil mastermind that you have painted him as is too harsh.

I just watched this movie recently so maybe that's why it comes to mind, but this situation reminds me a lot of The Generals Daughter.

I believe JoePa acted in what he thought was in the best interests of PSU, as morally reprehensible as that was.

The movie asks this question many times: "What's worse than rape." PSU fans/alumni are finding out the answer to that question right now.

[74Hunter]

Originally Posted by BSpringsteen

I think we are all in complete shock that this was Penn State and Joe Pa. To people outside of the program, they were almost beyond reproach. To people inside the school, to the fans Joe Pa was a God. Hayden Fry times ten.

How would we react if this happened Hayden's last year? Probably in the same state of disbelief.

Doesn't mean it didn't happen. Just because we love someone doesn't mean they are not capable of things we don't want to think about.......

There has to be more.

This is the problem right there. The fans (and general public) don't want to believe that this happened. The Coach, the AD, the President, campus police etc. either didn't want to bring shame to their university, or didn't want to be bothered by it.

And kids get abused. They have no where to turn. No one believes them.

What an f'ing debacle.

[VintageHawkeye]

Originally Posted by 74Hunter

This is the problem right there. The fans (and general public) don't want to believe that this happened. The Coach, the AD, the President, campus police etc. either didn't want to bring shame to their university, or didn't want to be bothered by it.

And kids get abused. They have no where to turn. No one believes them.

What an f'ing debacle.

We're witnessing a huge and graphic example of the stages of grief under the Kubler-Ross model.

1. Denial — "I feel fine."; "This can't be happening, not to me."
Denial is usually only a temporary defense for the individual. This feeling is generally replaced with heightened awareness of possessions and individuals that will be left behind after death.
2. Anger — "Why me? It's not fair!"; "How can this happen to me?"; '"Who is to blame?"
Once in the second stage, the individual recognizes that denial cannot continue. Because of anger, the person is very difficult to care for due to misplaced feelings of rage and envy.
3. Bargaining — "I'll do anything for a few more years."; "I will give my life savings if..."
The third stage involves the hope that the individual can somehow postpone or delay death. Usually, the negotiation for an extended life is made with a higher power in exchange for a reformed lifestyle. Psychologically, the individual is saying, "I understand I will die, but if I could just do something to buy more time..."
4. Depression — "I'm so sad, why bother with anything?"; "I'm going to die soon so what's the point... What's the point?"; "I miss my loved one, why go on?"
During the fourth stage, the dying person begins to understand the certainty of death. Because of this, the individual may become silent, refuse visitors and spend much of the time crying and grieving. This process allows the dying person to disconnect from things of love and affection. It is not recommended to attempt to cheer up an individual who is in this stage. It is an important time for grieving that must be processed.
5. Acceptance — "It's going to be okay."; "I can't fight it, I may as well prepare for it."
In this last stage, individuals begin to come to terms with their mortality, or that of a loved one, or other tragic event.

I'd say a vast majority of PSUers are in the midst of Stages 1 & 2, and we clearly saw some Stage 3 behavior in the past 24 hours.

[racerhawk]

Originally Posted by Clark

Scapegoat is too leniant. The evil mastermind that you have painted him as is too harsh.

I just watched this movie recently so maybe that's why it comes to mind, but this situation reminds me a lot of The Generals Daughter.

I believe JoePa acted in what he thought was in the best interests of PSU, as morally reprehensible as that was.

The movie asks this question many times: "What's worse than rape." PSU fans/alumni are finding out the answer to that question right now.

Maybe leaders can learn something from this. Put people (especially innocent children) above the institution. Even institutions like PSU or the Catholic church.

[EddyP]

This thing is sucking the life out of the college football season for me.

[BSpringsteen]

Originally Posted by EddyP

This thing is sucking the life out of the college football season for me.

Just wait until I mop the floor with you in the HN Awards.

[EddyP]

Originally Posted by BSpringsteen

Just wait until I mop the floor with you in the HN Awards.

Keep bumping your gums but little do you know I just got a great deal on some NU tickets and a parking pass.

[Billso]

Originally Posted by BSpringsteen

Right now, he is guilty of poor judgement. That just doesn't add up to me. It either has to be him getting a raw deal or him being much more involved. I've never known a successful football coach at a football U being a scapegoat. I don't know why he would be made to be the fall guy for the University. Ergo - I don't think he is getting a raw deal.

There has to be more.

Exactly.

[BSpringsteen]

Originally Posted by EddyP

Keep bumping your gums but little do you know I just got a great deal on some NU tickets and a parking pass.

Sumbitch

[okeefe4prez]

Originally Posted by BSpringsteen

Just wait until I mop the floor with you in the HN Awards.

I have forwarded this to the Committee. The Committee does not look favorably upon folks bragging about awards prior to the awards ceremony.

[BSpringsteen]

Originally Posted by okeefe4prez

I have forwarded this to the Committee. The Committee does not look favorably upon folks bragging about awards prior to the awards ceremony.

****.

[VintageHawkeye]

Originally Posted by BSpringsteen

****.

Your Jameson stunt is guaranteed to win you some sort of prestigious award, Boss.
If that doesn't happen, then I would push for a thorough investigation of The Committee.

[BSpringsteen]

Originally Posted by okeefe4prez

I have forwarded this to the Committee. The Committee does not look favorably upon folks bragging about awards prior to the awards ceremony.

OK4P - I'd like to send you a package in the mail of some of my finest moments this past year as well as a bottle of Oban. Also, I have some very compromising PM's from EddyP in which point he says very disparaging things about lawyers and your northwestern.

[Billso]

Originally Posted by okeefe4prez

I have forwarded this to the Committee. The Committee does not look favorably upon folks bragging about awards prior to the awards ceremony.

By contrast, I have great respect for the wisdom, authority and good judgment of the Committee. They are super-smart people who even smell good.

/shameless_suck-up-ery